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add downward cape #3120
add downward cape #3120
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I am so utterly confused as to why that is failing |
I was totally unaware of this until now, but this closes #728 if implemented |
Does this relate in any way to #823? |
it is the same as #823, oops, I didn't see that, I guess I had the wrong search terms. |
I'm happy to proceed here. #823 stalled out trying to replicate some values from SPC. How are we doing here? |
So this does not attempt to recreate the SPC's method, I based the parcel start location as " Once the start point is identified, use in the previous PR, #823, @kgoebber mentioned finding the LCL of a parcel between 500 and 700 hPa, as described by this NWS presentation. This produced (IMO) ridiclously high DCAPE values for the profiles I was testing with so I stopped doing that, but I'm open to discussion |
Okay, so I have been able to play a little bit with this PR and here is what I found:
So it seems that this version of downdraft CAPE falls between the method used by SPC and the one implemented in the RAOB program. Knowing that there is no one right answer, this PR seems to balance a number of factors and yields a value somewhere in the middle of other known dCAPE calculations. My only suggestion at this point is do we want to name the function My only question is how does our naming convection work if someone would come along and propose a different dCAPE calculation (e.g., one that matches SPC or RAOB)? |
@wx4stg the consensus on the MetPy call today was to call the function |
I couldn't find the SPC method fleshed out in this or related issues, so for reference, here is the description from the SharpPy source code:
I agree with @kgoebber that there isn't a need to replicate the SPC calculation in general. It only would be important in the case someone was investigating a population of soundings and comparing that to a population of soundings analyzed in the literature by Thompson or others at SPC. |
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One minor nitpick and I think this is ready to go.
Thanks for the contribution @wx4stg ! |
Quick comment here. I have been working on a project to implement DCIN (Downdraft Convective Inhibition) into SounderPy. I have developed a DCIN calculation based on: https://rmets.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1002/asl.727. I have done this "inside" the existing MetPy dcape function. Essentially, I use the Then I can thus return dcape, dcin, the parcel pressure trace, and parcel temperature trace. Some use DCIN as a way of determining the likelihood of severe downdraft winds in elevated convection environments. Would this be of any interest to include in future MetPy releases? |
@kylejgillett That would be great! I'm not sure if there's a good way to add this to the existing function (without breaking API), so I'm not sure the details. Regardless, we can discuss that in a draft PR or, if you prefer, a separate issue. |
I agree that this would be a nice feature to implement. Some notes on the design of the current dcape function, it's currently written in a way that it gives everything needed to both calculate DCAPE and plot the downdraft parcel on a SkewT. However this doesn't really line up with how the API works with updraft parcels, where the user is expected to calculate the parcel trajectory and CAPE separately. If I could go back to do it over again, I'd have a "downdraft_parcel" function where the user could specify whether they wanted minimum theta-e or most a particular level or something, and "downdraft_cape_cin" function which actually computes the integral, accepting a keyword arg for the parcel path (and if that's not provided, do some assumed default like generate one based on min theta-e) This feels suspiciously close to touching #461... |
This adds downward CAPE for vertical profiles.
There is basically zero agreement on where a downdraft parcel starts. Based on Gilmore and Wicker, 1998, I've decided to find the minimum theta-e from 700 hPa to 500 hPa and start from there.
Scientific discussion is welcomed and encouraged.